Name: Nick Kavallieratos: Lifestyle Services and Generational Planning
Uploaded: 2025-10-09T17:41:00Z
Duration: 20 min 39 s
Description: The Morgan Stanley managing director discusses the importance of regularly asking clients questions, understanding what matters most to them, and acknowledging that their priorities will likely change over time.

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The Morgan Stanley managing director discusses the importance of regularly asking clients questions, understanding what matters most to them, and acknowledging that their priorities will likely change over time.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20251009/0760f819-0d06-4fb9-8b41-429386ac37e6/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Nick Kavallieratos: Lifestyle Services and Generational Planning

Welcome to "Baron's Advisor," the Way Forward Next Generation, a special series spotlighting the emerging leaders shaping the future of financial advice. Twice a month, we'll be digging into the strategies, insights, and game changing moves that will help you take your practice to the next level. I'm your host, Alyson Tucci, and today with me is Nick Kavallieratos, a Managing Director and Financial Advisor at Morgan Stanley. And today we're gonna be talking about lifestyle services and why understanding personalities might be more important than understanding the market. So, why should advisors really lean in or care about lifestyle planning and what are some of the big misconceptions that advisors have?

Let's start with the bottom question, right? So, the biggest misconception is I've asked enough questions.

Mm-hmm.

You can never ask enough questions.

Okay, I like that.

Let's go back to the concept of it's ever breathing, evolving and it's evolutionary, not just to the question or the narrative of answering that question, but actually their lifestyle, right? Where you are today isn't where you're gonna be tomorrow. And so the idea is, it's your responsibility as an advisor to keep knowing away at those questions, right? Even if it doesn't make sense in the moment, it may make sense later on. And sometimes clients can turn around and say, why are you asking such nonsensical questions? And that's where your role comes into play, where you have to stand up to the plate, and say, look, I'm asking these questions because whether you want to know it or not, at some point we may have to address this particular matter. Now, having that level of a relationship, starts to build a level of trust, a marriage-

Mm-hmm.

That clients may feel uncomfortable at certain terms, right? But at the same token, they can rely on you. They can build that trust to the point where they look back and say, I know Nick is there for me. I know he's gonna help me find the right answer or determine whether or not this is the wrong outcome. And that's important. So, I would encourage the next generation of advisors, make sure you continuously ask questions, even if they may not be relevant in the moment.

Well, also, their client changes and involves.

Right.

Who you are at 20 is not the same as who you are at 30.

That's right.

You are at 40. So, to your point, the question might not be applicable now, but to get that trend analysis or thoughts on it, you're gonna wanna start building that legacy of how they answer the question.

Absolutely. I mean, I'll give you a perfect example, right? You have an individual spent their entire life building out their own business.

Mm-hmm

They finally decide to cash out. Now in the back of their mind, they're saying, I'm ready to retire. I'm gonna grab that fishing boat. I'm moving to West Palm Beach and I'm gonna start casting every single day.

Mm-hmm.

Well, guess what? They happen to have two daughters. And one of 'em marries a very entrepreneurial young man who's very determined, very eager. And so the last thing furthest from their mind is I'm going to co-invest with my new to become son-in-law.

I don't think anyone thinks about that.

An X, Y, Z business, right? But it's my responsibility as their advisor to plan for something like that, to say, Hey, listen, somewhere down the line, if you exited outta this business for X amount of dollars, or X amount of dollars gonna be sufficient and enough for you to retire without the thought or perspective of ever doing something greater in the future, whether it be directly or indirectly for your children, for a family member, for another business associate, for another opportunity. And so by asking the right questions and setting that right foundation and planting that seed, I start to build that tangential story for them-

Mm-hmm.

And find the right outcome. So, when the time comes, if they come to the table and say, actually, I just happen to come across this opportunity, I can say, guess what? We have an answer and the right solution, and we're gonna help you with your lifestyle management. 'Cause it all boils back to that philosophy and that lifestyle preservation.

When do you think is a great time to start the conversation as an advisor with your client about generational planning? And are there any triggers for that?

Yeah, absolutely. So, one of the first primary points of interest that comes to surface is when a client says, look, I definitely want to preserve and protect my capital, but at the same time, I wanna live my life, right?

Mm-hmm.

And that in itself becomes a bifurcated kind of direction in terms of goals and aspirations because you say, okay, well what's the preservation of capital for? Right? And so you start embarking on this journey with the client saying, are you preserving the capital because you wanna provide for the next generation, wanna provide for philanthropic giving? Are you a person within the community that likes to contribute within certain community services, et cetera?

Mm-hmm.

Right? And that starts to embark on this journey of, okay, how can we start to create these parallels where we can accomplish both goals, right? And for each client, it's different. Believe it or not, what happens is that you find some clients who turn around and they're very much motivated to accomplish that goal at first glance.

Mm-hmm.

And then, you know, two, three, four years down the line, they come to you, they say, you know what? I've changed course. I've just spent six months in Italy and I realize that, you know, I don't want to give as much money to my local community service department in New York City. I now want to give to a village that I spent the last six months in, right?

Mm-hmm.

And so you have to shapeshift a little bit with the client. And that all rolls back to the whole idea of behavioral finance and understanding your clients and the philosophy behind it, right? It's ever evolving and breathing. And so I would say the most adaptive part of this role and responsibility is understanding that it's a communicative effort. It isn't just this, you know, steadfast I've generated this financial plan, and therefore you need to follow the script to perfection, right? There are edits every step of the way.

I like that. It's not following a script, following a plan, it's adjusting and molding with your client.

Yes.

Now in speaking towards clients that have multiple generations, you hear this a lot, that by the third generation, things just tend to blow up.

Yeah, yeah.

Why is that? And how can a financial advisor help their client to prevent that third generation blow up.

Yeah. What we have found with many and most of the clients that we work with and the families that we work with, is that it's all about education. It's all about finding that right point of inflection to insert that education and help to reaffirm a knowledge set, not just about how to invest in the markets, right? It's talking about stocks, bonds, mutual funds is one thing, but talking about the foundational philosophy behind what finance and lifestyle management means for that particular family starts to create this narrative that's significantly more impactful to the next generation. And that's where they start to build more and more of a foundation on that philosophy. And that's really where we come into play. We play the role of helping to pass the message down the line, every step of the way.

That's right.

And so that mission statement becomes tried and true throughout time and throughout generation to generation

In a market where inflation is stickier than I think we all presumed. And people are now questioning how expensive is milk gonna be? Or how expensive are eggs going to be in 15 years or so?

Sure.

How do you have that conversation with a client who's saying, I want to put away enough money so that my kids and my grandkids can go through school, but I have no idea the cost of eggs in 15 years.

Yeah. It's an ever evolving conversation. So, what eggs cost today or milk costs today might not be what eggs cost tomorrow, or what milk costs tomorrow for that matter, that we even consume eggs or milk tomorrow, right? But at the end of the day, I'm a strong believer in the fact that you need to grow with your families over time and help them understand the adaptability of what's happening in the environment, and how it affects or causes change within their lives, generation to generation. So, you know, I can tell you that I'm a big coffee drinker, my kids are not so much big coffee drinkers. Not to say that coffee ever goes away. 'Cause I think half the universe would cease to exist, but at the end of the day, you know, I have to be respectful of the fact that they're into energy drinks or these smoothies as opposed to drinking coffee every day, right? And those drinks happen to be significantly more expensive than coffee. And so I have to account for that. And helping the present generation determine what the future generation is looking for and how they're spending is critical to the equation. Because it's almost like the passing of the baton.

Mm-hmm.

On figuring out the right methodology in which you're passing that baton, and the type of baton to pass.

So, for a financial advisor listening and they go, that sounds great.

Mm-hmm.

I wanna learn how to pass the baton between gen one and gen two of my client.

Sure.

What are some of the questions or tips and tricks you would tell an advisor so that they understand how to guide their client or what to say to their client during this time?

Yeah. I'll answer this question a little bit differently. Our approach is very much evolutionary in the sense that we don't only ask the questions the first or second time we meet, we ask those questions continuously.

'Cause the answers my change.

That's exactly correct. And therefore, the evolution of the answer becomes the precedented model for how we continue to evolve with the client.

Interesting.

Yeah.

So, you basically do almost a trend analysis-

100%.

Of their answers over a period of time, and it gives you insight into their relationship with money and that change as it's occurring.

Exactly. And a perfect example of that is we have found universally across all of the families that we work with, over time, we've seen an interesting trend in an increase in travel. So, we may build a relationship with a client, and one of the first questions we say is, how many trips do you take a year? Right? And where do you go? And so within meeting one, meeting two, they might turn around and say, well, we take two vacations a year and here's how we like to live. And it's a little bit lavish, but we enjoy ourselves. Our average spend is between 50 to $70,000.

Mm-hmm.

And this is what we do. And then we find a year two, they come back and they say, well, we're gonna go on this third trip and it's so unique, and it's our first time doing this, and we're splurging. And by year three they say, well, now three trips a year is mandatory. And you look back to the client, you say, you remember when we first met and you said two trips of what we did, and you started spending 50 to 70,000. Well, now your trips are mounting to 100, 150,000 and you're taking three a year. So, we have to budget and we have to plan for this. And we have to think about the fact that you're not only building that philosophy for yourself, but you're passing that same image down to the next generation. So, when the kids get older, is the expectation that they're gonna take at a minimum three trips or does that evolve to four? Right?

Oh, wow.

And we build on that. And we help them realize that there's a balance to all of those components of the equation.

Mm-hmm.

And we help them solve for that mathematical formula.

For advisors that are now getting into, you know, financial advice and they're working with a generation that's seeing this more too, right? What advice would you give them specifically on how to have that conversation about travel?

You know, I will share with you a quick anecdotal story in terms of next gen client comes in and they are now having children. Their children are teenagers. And so the teenage child, the teenage son comes to me and he says, look, I know you're gonna sit me down and talk to me about how much money, like I need to focus on not spending ski trips, et cetera, mountain climbing, he does a lot of mountain biking, all this kind of stuff. And he said, but I can justify all of this. I don't need a car, Uber's around, and when I don't need a car, I don't need to spend a ton of money purchasing a 50 or $60,000 vehicle because I can use an Uber, and when I don't use an Uber, then I can ride my bike. And so they look at things significantly different in terms of scoopability and how what we used to once upon a time called inferior goods and services or necessity-bound items in life are, right? I think what they've done is shifted. This next generation has shifted the idea of inferior goods and services and necessity-bound items to more lifestyle and experiential living.

In an area where you have to stay attuned to the market. We do not want market fads to really dictate what you advise. How do you do both at the same time?

It's definitely a balance. And I think the balance comes into play the longer we develop the relationship with the client. Because clients come to us periodically and they say, oh, by the way, I think this is a great stock bond mutual fund idea. Can we look into this? What do you think? And so we have to recenter that philosophy once again, right? Our main objective is making sure that we go back to that mission statement that we talked about. And by the way, as we said earlier, that mission statement may evolve. So, there might come a turning point where the client says, look, I can appreciate the mission statement and I can appreciate the fact that we've been following it for the past X number of years, but there's a portion of my investments, my portfolio, my strategy, my outlook that I want to carve up for X, y, z purpose, right?

Mm-hmm.

And so we try and adapt to the way the clients think about not just the present and the future, but also their narrative in the moment of how they're looking at things philosophically.

And as you mentioned, that can change quite rapidly.

Quite rapidly.

And you probably kind of expect it to. Do you expect it to change with AI and not after investing with artificial intelligence?

Yeah, absolutely. Artificial intelligence will become the cornerstone of the next 10 to 15 years without question, in my mind. I think that it will forever change the landscape in a good way, but I think it has to be adaptive towards humanity. What I mean by that is I think we have to embrace it under the right context and not use it under the wrong context, right? It's not a quick fix to anything. It is another tool within our tool chest to learn and evolve as humans and to figure out how to leverage it in the right opportunities without taking advantage of any type of disruptions in the market negatively.

So, how do you see it fitting into generational planning?

You know, I think it will help us really figure out and determine the right narrative behind different personalities. I think if we had to scope out a map and say, hey, what did personalities look like in the 1920s and the 1950s-

Mm-hmm.

And the 1970s and the 1980s? I think we probably could fit it all on one sheet of paper. And now I think you need multiple sheets of paper and multiple stacks to figure out how it all kind of grows and evolves. And so I think AI will help us determine more customization, more collaboration, and more, I would say connectivity correlation behind people and their perspectives and their, I don't wanna say selfish beliefs, but self-focused beliefs, right? In the right way.

In terms of helping your clients prepare.

Yes.

For, whether this is market uncertainty, whether it's this AI conversation, whether it's the next pickier poison really with what's been happening in the globe recently. How do you prepare your clients for that?

I don't know that we quote unquote prepare our clients for it. I think we make them aware of things, right?

Mm-hmm.

As they evolve. That evolution becomes adaptive. So, our role isn't to prepare them for a dramatic change, but to make sure that their lifestyle doesn't change, given the changes that are happening around them. So, if a client says, Hey, I still want to take three trips a year, but there's so much dramatic change, geopolitical, et cetera going on, it's our job to make sure that if they want to make that choice-

Mm-hmm.

They have the financial means and the ability to do so independent of what's happening globally.

So, playing on that thread, what have been some common things that a client thinks might matter or like actually really doesn't matter.

To some degree it all does matter in some degree or relevance, but what is less important is, I believe for our clients, the majority of our clients, the tax implications, right? Like clients who are multi-generational wealth and provide for multi-generational wealth transfer get really hung up on the notion of taxation, when in fact we're all gonna pay taxes and it's just an inevitable truth.

Taxes and death, right?

Taxes and death for sure. And so I think finding the right balance where it's not a zero sum output, right? Is critical in explaining to clients and working with their tax advisors, working with their tax professionals to make sure that they understand from an investment standpoint, from a life management standpoint, the impact isn't as great as they may personally think.

How would you want to wrap this up? One last thing to leave our listeners with.

Go outside your comfort zone, right? Just like your client, every single advisor has their own personality, their own style, their own approach, but expand your horizon, expand your perspective on how you think about life, and be open-minded to the idea that sometimes understanding your client's lifestyle helps you bring and develop a closer relationship with them and their family.

Perfect. Well Nick, thank you so much for being here today.

Thank you.

I really appreciate your time.

Thank you very much for having me here.