Name: Tech’s New Rivalry: TikTok vs. Amazon
Uploaded: 2023-10-23T22:11:00Z
Duration: 6 min 8 s
Description: A new rivalry is forming between TikTok and Amazon. Both companies want to dominate the burgeoning market for “social shopping” in the U.S. WSJ reporter Meghan Bobrowsky joins host Zoe Thomas to discuss how the tech giants are stepping on each other's turf. Illustration: Peter Arkle

https://www.barrons.com/client

Topics

Memberships

Tools

Customer Service

Network

Newsstand

For Business

For Education

For Advertisers

Account

About Barron's

bolded

unBolded

Ken Burns, the filmmaker behind the documentary miniseries "The American Revolution" and others, spoke to Barron's editor at large Andy Serwer.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260507/0291a39f-ea0f-4e3b-8f5f-c6783863e213/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Filmmaker Ken Burns on 'the Most Important Revolution in History'

Jane Fraser, CEO of Citigroup, discusses how they scale their business, their global footprint, and investing in digital assets.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260506/c85686e1-e814-47e7-a3dc-72a0170fa2c9/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Citigroup CEO on Keeping Competitors at Bay

As CEO of Citigroup, Jane Fraser tells Barron’s Andy Serwer about her goals for the future.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260506/904afc41-63ad-4d30-94d5-fe292999af50/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Planning for Growth at Citigroup

Jane Fraser, CEO of Citigroup, sat down for an interview with Barron's Editor at Large Andy Serwer.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260430/9cbc994b-3c3c-4ab2-994c-1363ccf00ade/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Citigroup CEO: 'We're Cheap. Get on the Train.'

Michel Khalaf, chief executive officer of MetLife, discusses how he’s navigating the current market.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260501/91689664-d41c-4215-8400-ea340e71cf8d/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Risk Management in a K-Shaped Economy

“I’m a big believer in a level playing field,” Michel Khalaf, chief executive officer of MetLife, tells Barron’s Andy Serwer.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260501/0a4674b6-10e7-4a91-bd96-c6a2e6aa7fe2/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Why MetLife’s CEO Supports Private Equity in Insurance

Michel Khalaf, chief executive officer of MetLife, spoke to Barron's editor at large Andy Serwer.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260423/d5471223-ead4-4616-a52a-63b6722abe1e/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

MetLife's CEO Explains How AI Has Helped the Insurance Company

Constantine Alexandrakis, CEO of the executive search firm Russell Reynolds Associates, discusses the pattern of higher turnover rates and shorter tenures of CEOs.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260501/2fec28b4-35fb-4ff1-9864-55d5538b0973/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Being a CEO Is Becoming More Complicated, According to This Executive

At Barron's

"Your 9-5...is just not going to do it," Nick Magguilli, personal finance expert, said on Barron's Streetwise podcast.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20251216/e6897805-d131-4cc4-9c59-ca03b0c0b958/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

How to Scale Your Net Worth

TJ Thornton, Head of Global Research Product Marketing at BofA Securities, talks to Jack Hough about his favorite stocks outside of AI.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20251210/f9c1a95c-5a0e-4349-9fe4-73b3ac53bfb8/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

BofA’s Favorite Non-AI Stocks

Jack Hough talks to TJ Thornton, Head of Global Research Product Marketing at BofA Securities about diversifying stocks to hedge AI risks.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20251210/8e164ff7-1500-4c2f-8713-e891c640a0f4/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Evaluating Investing Opportunities Beyond AI

Steve Quirk, chief brokerage officer at Robinhood, breaks down the value of tokenizing stocks in different markets.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20251126/f86d65ea-bd8b-4777-b6b0-80f7bb12027e/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Unpacking Tokenization for Everyday Investors

Jack Hough talks to Steve Quirk, chief brokerage officer at Robinhood, about trends in retail investing.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20251126/a9cbdcc6-f060-4fc9-a15e-396924e25946/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

How Robinhood Reshaped the Trading Landscape for an Entire Generation

Streetwise host Jack Hough sat down with strategist Scott Wren to discuss how the AI-fueled market run stacks up against the dot-com boom.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20251111/bd2e1a5b-1a6e-4543-8133-dcc63f69b5dc/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

AI vs. The Dot Com Bubble

Bank of America’s Haim Israel shares what’s next for Nuclear Energy development.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20250930/ab4fc336-af44-4af2-8e40-9ae6f04a445e/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

The Outlook For Nuclear

Jack talks to Lyft CEO David Risher about growth potential in the company.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20250929/ae62b70e-912b-4ce7-ae63-1b2652628bae/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Lyft's Ride to Profit

The stock market is expensive. What does that mean for your portfolio? Jack sits down with Franklin Templeton’s Matt Quinlan to talk dividend investing, and whether it’s a good move in a pricey market.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20250911/9c85e132-d710-4458-9467-aa69d4f25ae0/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Dividends and Capital Appreciation

Barron's Streetwise

CEO Chris Todd explains how the company is providing core technology to RIAs and broker dealers while building infrastructure to meet future advisor needs in areas like alternative investments and digital currencies.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260512/06d41382-0347-4765-b253-994badc172a3/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Envestnet’s ‘Bullseye’ Strategic Approach  

Interviews with top wealth management professionals about topics including compensation, hiring, marketing, next-gen, and more.

CEO Chris Todd says the company is using AI to increase internal productivity and leveraging its large data set to provide "investment data insights" to help advisors manage client portfolios.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260512/4207fb3b-4df7-43b2-8c1e-32d3cb75967f/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

How Envestnet Is Harnessing AI and Data 

Yie-Hsin Hung, president and CEO of State Street Investment Management, describes how the company addresses retirement challenges like increased longevity and the shift of responsibility from pensions to individuals.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260428/266b9598-bb99-4025-9b2e-d17b76104723/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Empowering Investors to Better Prepare for Retirement

Yie-Hsin Hung, president and CEO of State Street Investment Management, says that retirement is a vital business segment, accounting for about a quarter of the company’s global assets.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260428/ea1e71f0-04bc-4b92-9b82-e52911542bd5/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Retirement Is a ‘Very Important Part’ of State Street’s Business

ETF flows reveal a “widening out” of exposure away from large caps, says Yie-Hsin Hung, president and CEO of State Street Investment Management.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260428/735ae074-7b28-4394-879a-5959b7675c9e/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

U.S. Investors Are Embracing Small-Cap and Mid-Cap Stocks

Yie-Hsin Hung, president and CEO, says the company is focused on growth in fixed income products, international markets, and the overall wealth category.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260428/718c379d-03d5-4861-be33-fa3c4f56cef7/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Where State Street Investment Management Sees Opportunity

Within five years, “the consumer will have the ability to go online and design their financial advisor—what they look like, how they talk, how they interact, what they remember,” says Rob Nelson, CEO and founder of NorthRock Partners.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260415/09483094-28db-4623-a9b2-df5b9327dffa/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

The Future AI Advisor

Rob Nelson, CEO and founder of NorthRock Partners, explains why he is optimistic about the future of financial advice and the potential for advisors to form meaningful client communities.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260415/4bc66985-8aab-4e8a-b646-8e3023cdd9b0/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

The Jevons Paradox and Placing a Premium on Community

Rob Nelson, CEO and founder of NorthRock Partners, says clients today place a premium on having free time and peace of mind.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260415/528964a5-1d56-41bf-9931-bf152533679b/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

How Client Expectations Have Changed in the Past 15 Years

Barron's Advisor The Way Forward

A “willingness to roll up your sleeves and understand the issues that your clients are facing, not just from an investment perspective,” is common among the industry’s most successful, says Kelly Gaur, a Mercer Advisors regional vice president.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260319/318adb2f-a888-4f30-b182-c791e27f98ab/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Best Advice for Someone Considering Wealth Management as a Career

Kelly Gaur, a Mercer Advisors regional vice president, says she was drawn to working for a registered investment advisor partly because they generally offer a more personalized, modern approach to wealth management.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260318/5575e9ca-0b48-4fb9-8e43-82aae1b3e3fc/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

The Appeal of Working for an RIA

“The best client development professionals are those who have served clients in some capacity,” says Kelly Gaur, a Mercer Advisors regional vice president.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260318/c1638929-6b21-4573-9deb-4f78e1ffa1d7/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Client-Facing Experience Can Help Advance Your Career

The Mercer Advisors regional vice president discusses her business development role and tips for breaking into the industry and gaining valuable experience in a non-advisory capacity.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260318/f2c2c9a5-cb67-4167-a48b-7fe4a9285615/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Kelly Gaur: Tips for Pursuing Non-Advisor Roles in Wealth Management

“You want to make sure that everybody's excited and prepared and that you're all pulling the rope in the same direction,” says Nate Fisher, managing director and wealth advisor at Carson Wealth.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260305/20285ef5-c115-435f-9291-e4f2d5b166a9/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

A Successful Transition Requires Honesty and a ‘Heavy Lift’

Young advisors considering a succession plan should maximize engagement with clients because “it can take a long time to gain that trust and build those relationships,” says Nate Fisher, managing director and wealth advisor at Carson Wealth.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260305/236fdaa2-5acb-48e9-b16d-e20b58846487/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Succession Planning and Establishing Trust With Clients

The Carson Wealth managing director and wealth advisor says his decision to partner with the firm was driven by the need for increased capacity for holistic services and a clear succession plan for his retiring father.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260305/33bb1217-c8be-4358-ba17-6238cbab6fa1/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Nate Fisher: Lessons Learned From a Successful Partnership

As trust grows, advisors tend to spend less time discussing investments and more time on clients’ families and well-being, says Nate Fisher, managing director and wealth advisor at Carson Wealth.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260305/d2d3903a-994f-4ae7-82be-706929930b3d/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Trusted Advisors Focus Less on Investments, More on Clients' Lives 

Serving tech founders is a full-time, long-term effort that often requires significant upfront work before a successful, revenue-generating relationship is established, says Katie Partridge, a Morgan Stanley private wealth advisor.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260219/abc63bad-4c7a-474b-b4a8-b4feae461375/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Landing Founders as Clients Requires Patience and Hard Work

Barron's Advisor Next Generation

Government policy shapes retirement regardless of savings or lifespan. With Social Security's trust fund facing a 2033 shortfall, what fixes are coming? Our experts discuss policy shifts and how to budget your benefits.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260410/aea80278-298b-458e-8bcd-f378796d6328/2/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

What's Next for Social Security?

Stocks swoop and soar as investors weigh AI hype against rate-cut "tea leaves." Our panelists explain how to drown out the noise, chart your own winning path,and identify investments that offer true long-term rewards.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260410/586aecf7-117b-4f3e-86f0-6869d907e671/2/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Riding the Market Roller Coaster

The capture of Venezuela’s Nicolás Maduro and Middle East tensions are reshaping oil supply expectations. The U.S. is intervening in energy markets in decades-unseen ways. Experts break down what’s next for oil, gas and energy stocks.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260212/9779ec13-602a-4a38-bb73-495ff464a24f/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Oil and Gas in a Volatile World

For the first time in decades, U.S. power demand is rising - driven by AI data centers, EVs and electrification. Utility and clean-energy stocks are climbing, but costly buildouts threaten affordability. We explore what’s next for the power trade.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20260212/81a81fdd-47b4-44f6-93d1-7597a7fab032/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

The Gold Rush in Electricity

Will Nvidia and other technology companies keep powering the stock market in 2026? We'll speak with two veteran money managers about their views on tech and their favorite stocks for the coming year.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20251212/5683d7a0-ed1f-4e3c-b913-bb3367ea3abd/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Finding Bargains in a Pricey Market

Explore what could go right for investors, and what could go wrong, in a year that will see the AI trade evolve, the Fed's leadership change, and global competition for resources increase in this 2026 Outlook.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20251212/573f5954-c4ab-43e9-804d-f1ea93fbb70c/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Meeting the Challenge

Stocks are expensive, risks abound, and AI is about to change the world. Other than that, building a calamity-proof retirement portfolio should be a cinch. Tune in as two veteran money managers size up the markets and share their investment ideas.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20250211/17a5e7d6-7c36-44b0-a35e-bf5ac3a24194/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Saving for a Sunny Day

Research shows that people greatly underestimate the healthcare costs they’ll face in retirement. Learn from experts how to estimate those costs, prepare for potential long-term care needs, and manage healthcare expenses in retirement.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20250211/e7c022d9-badf-4e95-8e7c-0b6fce9f7823/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Are You Fiscally Fit?

Surging power demand, new energy sources, and growing competition have spurred the utility industry to become more innovative than ever before. Our panelists will unpack the changes afoot and explore what lies ahead for companies, customers, and investors.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20240917/001ea098-1fcc-4da5-9f0e-a3b149bbb2fb/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Not Your Father's Utility

Barron's Roundtable

Whether you're leading a transition, building a scalable team, or just trying to stay ahead of the curve, this episode will give you practical insights to lead smarter and grow stronger.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20251010/fd26d60b-d1e6-409b-b51b-101da4aaa368/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Next-Gen Leadership Meets Smart Innovation

Electric vehicles sales are growing but not at the pace some expected. Some would-be buyers worry about the range of EV charging, and others are swayed by politics. But innovators from Detroit to Silicon Valley still envision a dramatic shift in how we get around. What’s going on and what’s next?

https://m.wsj.net/video/20240603/5784fa60-791c-47ad-9740-42e4553de5c4/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Forces Shaping EV Adoption and the Future of Driving

Success in improving the power grid to accommodate the electricity demands of the future will be a boon for companies doing the work and utilities that succeed. Explore the investing risks and opportunities.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20240522/2b825c69-2687-4d88-923b-0c8f523a2f67/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

How to Invest in Initiatives to Bolster the Power Grid

Joanna Rotenberg, Fidelity's president of personal investing, discusses ways to make investing more accessible and how to bolster your own financial security.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20231025/8ad733df-ac90-41fd-9655-7761b3e0532c/2/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Mind the Gap: Demystifying Investing

Reshma Kapadia sits down with Cozy Wittman of College Inside Track to discuss how to tackle all things college, from what admission officers are seeking today, to navigating the different ways to funding higher education and evaluating the ROIs.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20230515/b7229011-05cc-42ec-9c16-1d7752ec668d/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Decoding the College Search and Financing Puzzle

Nicole Webb, financial advisor and SVP at Wealth Enhancement Group, shares ways to navigate the real estate market this spring whether you are a first-time buyer, a retiree downsizing or someone who is relocating or looking for a second home.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20230424/93eb00e1-caf0-4e83-9fc7-b502a57dc546/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Pro Tips on Buying and Selling a Home

Reggie Fils-Aimé, former president and COO of Nintendo of America, joins Barron's deputy editor Alex Eule to discuss his unlikely rise to the top, and the risks he took once there to beat the odds and achieve success.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20220630/61e2296d-ab1a-4216-ae65-24676447c616/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

How Nintendo's Former President Disrupted the Gaming Industry

2050 Wealth Planners co-CEO Lazetta Rainey Braxton, Sequoia Financial Planners vice president Elizabeth Scheiderer, and MoneyZen founder Manisha Thakor offer tips on how to prepare for recession, inflation, caregiving needs.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20220617/a71025ce-518b-49b9-b098-21417863f8ce/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Financial Advice for the Inflation-Weary

Families and advisors have a lot to navigate when it comes to generational wealth transfer. Add sustainable investing to the list. Examine strategies to help close the generational divide. From the Dow Jones Energy & Sustainability event series.

https://m.wsj.net/video/20230210/85cbf3f9-b5ab-4bfa-93c6-f8e8a247d386/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Sustainable Investing and the Wealth Transfer

Barron's Events

Level Up

Barron's Explains

Back to Business

Great Investors

MarketWatch

Video Center - Barron's home

A new rivalry is forming between TikTok and Amazon. Both companies want to dominate the burgeoning market for “social shopping” in the U.S. WSJ reporter Meghan Bobrowsky joins host Zoe Thomas to discuss how the tech giants are stepping on each other's turf. Illustration: Peter Arkle

https://m.wsj.net/video/20231023/cb711a64-5be4-4c21-8368-b819fafb2b3d/1/hls/manifest-hd-wifi.m3u8

Tech’s New Rivalry: TikTok vs. Amazon

Zoe: Welcome to "Tech News Briefing." It's Monday, October 23rd. I'm Zoe Thomas for the Wall Street Journal. Tech is known for its rivalries. Think Apple versus Microsoft, Facebook versus Twitter. And add to that, Amazon versus TikTok? The e-commerce giant and video sharing app may not seem like they run in the same field, but increasingly, they are stepping on each other's turf. Our reporter, Meghan Bobrowsky, is here to talk more about this. Meghan, how is it that these two companies are even crossing paths?

Meghan: So they both come at this from different perspectives. There's this goal and this new opportunity with social e-commerce, buying things that you see on social media. And so TikTok right now is great for discovery. People discover a lot of products on TikTok, but then, they go to Amazon to actually buy them. And what TikTok wants to do is make it so that you discover the product on TikTok and then you can also buy the product right there. Whereas, Amazon knows that it's good at being the place where people buy things, but it also wants to be the place where people discover things now.

Zoe: How big of an opportunity is this for both companies?

Meghan: This is still a very nascent market but researchers who track this stuff, they say that the market is already over $60 billion. Every year, people are buying things on social media and spending billions of dollars doing this, and they expect that by 2025, this is gonna be an industry that's worth a hundred billion dollars.

Zoe: Okay, so potentially a massive opportunity for both companies. Let's talk a bit about how they're each doing in this space, starting with TikTok. I mean, how are its sales and logistics doing? And particularly how are they doing compared to Amazon?

Meghan: So TikTok is selling anywhere from five to $7 million of goods a day. Whereas, if you compare that to Amazon, they're selling a little bit closer to $600 million of goods a day.

Zoe: And what is TikTok's goal here? If they're at five to 7 million now, what are they striving for?

Meghan: So TikTok, has been kind of quiet about these plans but sources we've talked to have said that their goal is to reach $10 million a day in sales by the end of the year. You know, this is something where they're putting a lot of resources, they're building out logistics operation centers, they're poaching Amazon employees. They're putting a lot of money into this. Certainly, TikTok has another revenue stream. It makes its money from advertising, but they're putting a lot of eggs in this basket and really trying to make this work in a way that other social media companies have not put as many resources into in the past.

Zoe: Amazon has this big logistics network to get products to consumers. How is TikTok matching that? Or are they even trying to match it?

Meghan: So TikTok is working on building out a logistics infrastructure, but right now, sellers are shipping the products themselves.

Zoe: All right, so that's the TikTok side. What about on the Amazon side? Because people may write reviews, but you don't exactly go to Amazon for the social engagement.

Meghan: Totally. We got some data for the story, and it showed that on average users spend two hours a day on TikTok and they spend like 15 minutes a day on Amazon. So you're not going to Amazon to hang out. And that's certainly been my personal experience as well. I don't know about you.

Zoe: It's not where I go to find my friends.

Meghan: But Amazon is trying to change that. They created this new tab called Inspire on the app and what it does is it shows you a stream of video content very similar to how TikTok works. So you can kind of scroll and the idea is that you would discover products to buy there. But you know, many of the people I spoke to for this story, people who are shoppers, had never heard of it.

Zoe: So does it seem like this is helping their sales then?

Meghan: So right now, no, this is not making a difference for them.

Zoe: What does this mean for influencers? I mean, the ones who are actually kind of hawking these products to their followers?

Meghan: Historically, if you were an influencer and you were trying to sell products, you would go to TikTok and post about them to your followers, but then you would link what's called an Amazon storefront. And it's this link that you would have in your bio and it has all the things that you're trying to sell. But you do have to leave an app and go to another app. And you know, there's a bit of friction there. But with this idea of social shopping, you're doing it all in one app. So for TikTok, you would be advertising or promoting your product, and then they'd just be able to link it right there. And so one of the influencers I spoke to for this story said that she's made thousands more dollars on TikTok than Amazon because of this new feature. And she's told me that she advertised this teeth whitening tool on TikTok, and she made $20,000 doing this. So she also uses Amazon to link her products. And she said that she's never made more than a thousand dollars a month on Amazon.

Zoe: Have either Amazon or TikTok commented on this rivalry?

Meghan: So I interviewed a TikTok executive for this story and she declined to comment on whether they see Amazon as a competitor in the space. But she said this is the big change of how people are shopping and the, you know, they're definitely trying to get into this, and this is a big thing for them. And on the flip side, an Amazon spokesperson also acknowledged that social shopping has grown for them in the past five years. You know, they're both giving validity to the space but I don't think either are willing to go as far as saying yes, that is my new enemy.

Zoe: All right, that's our reporter, Meghan Bobrowsky. Thanks so much for joining us.

Meghan: Thanks for having me.

Zoe: And that's it for "Tech News Briefing." Today's show was produced by me, your host Zoe Thomas, with Julie Chang and supervising producer Melanie Roy. For more tech stories from the Wall Street Journal, check out our website, wsj.com. We'll be back tomorrow. Thanks for listening.

WSJ’s tech podcast featuring breaking news, scoops and tips on tech innovations and policy debates, plus exclusive interviews with movers and shakers in the industry.